Where have all the real 'Shia' Scholars gone... ???

by Azadar E Mazloom Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:49 am

Bismillah Hirahman Niraheem,

Ya Ali (as) Madad,

For those who don't yet know, please view the following link. For those who have not yet heard of this, prepare to be shocked...

The Iranian leader Khamenei, begins by issuing a fatwa in which he bans Azadari in Iran and for all Shia's everywhere. Being the 'supreme leader', not only does he do absolutely NOTHING in regards to protecting Azadar Shia but even condones the torture, imprisonment and murder of Shia Azadars. So much animosity and hatred does he have against Azadari, he even asked for mourners not to cry loudly during majalis e Hussain (as). Shockingly, many Shia (like sheep) still continued to follow his every command.

That is followed later by his despicable comments stating that our Aima (as) were (mazallah) not fair and made mistakes. (Not sure where that leaves our notion of the 14 Masum as). The video for this may be found here: http://www.onlydemocracy4iran.com/2010/04/22/video-khamenei-to-iran-fortunately-youre-not-wealhty-but-i-am/

And now, THIS...

http://www.abna.ir/data.asp?lang=3&id=207222

"Insulting Symbols of Sunni Brothers Forbidden": Imam Khamenei

Ayatollah Khamenei issued a fatwa, declared unlawful the insulting Prophet's wife Aisha, and any of the Sunni Islamic symbols.

"Insulting Symbols of Sunni Brothers Forbidden": Imam Khamenei

Ahlul Bayt News Agency ; The Translation Text of Fatwa is as follows:

World Shia Leader, Imam Sayyed Ali Khamenei, issued a fatwa, declared unlawful the insulting Prophet's wife Aisha, and any of the Sunni Islamic symbols.

Islamic World widely welcomed the fatwa.

Imam Khamenei in response to question announced: "insulting the symbols of the Sunni brothers, including the Prophet Muhammad's wife [Aisha] is forbidden. This includes the women of all prophets and especially the holy Prophet Muhammad (PBUH)."

الإمام الخامنئي: يحرم النيل من رموز إخواننا السُنة و نساء النبي(ص)

جاء ذلك في اجابة على استفتاء وجهه جمع من علماء ومثقفي الاحساء في أعقاب الإساءات الأخيرة التي وجهها شخص نکرة باسم «ياسر الحبيب» المقيم في لندن لزوجة النبي عائشة.

وكان المستفتون طالبوا السيد الخامنئي بإبداء رأيه حول ما ورد من "اهانة صريحة وتحقير بكلمات بذيئة ومسيئة لزوج الرسول ام المؤمنين السيدة عائشة".

وقال الخامنئي جوابا على ذلك "يحرم النيل من رموز إخواننا السنة فضلاً عن اتهام زوج النبي بما يخل بشرفها بل هذا الأمر ممتنع على نساء الأنبياء وخصوصاً سيدهم الرسول الأعظم ".

وتعد فتوى الخامنئي هذه الأحدث والأرفع مستوى ضمن ردود الفعل الشيعية واسعة النطاق استنكارا للاساءة التي وجهها الحبيب للسيدة عائشة.

وكان العشرات من الرموز الدينية الشيعية البارزة في السعودية والخليج وايران دانت بشدة في تصريحات وبيانات التعرض بالاساءة للسيدة عائشة أو أي من أزواج النبي الأكرم (ص).

.....................

نص الاستفتاء:

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

سماحة آية الله العظمى السيد علي الخامنئي الحسيني دام ظله الوارف

السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته ،،

تمر الامة الاسلامية بأزمة منهج يؤدي الى اثارت الفتن بين ابناء المذاهب الاسلامية ، وعدم رعا ية الأولويات لوحدة صف المسلمين ، مما يكون منشا لفتن داخلية وتشتيت الجهد الاسلامي في المسائل الحساسة والمصيرية ، ويؤدي الى صرف النظر عن الانجازات التي تحققت على يد ابناء الامة الاسلامية في فلسطين ولبنان والعراق وتركيا وايران والدول الاسلامية ، ومن افرازات هذا المنهج المتطرف طرح ما يوجب الاساءة الى رموز ومقدسات اتباع الطائفة السنية الكريمة بصورة متعمدة ومكررة .

فما هو رأي سماحتكم في ما يطرح في بعض وسائل الاعلام من فضائيات وانترنت من قبل بعض المنتسبين الى العلم من اهانة صريحة وتحقير بكلمات بذيئة ومسيئة لزوج الرسول صلى الله عليه واله ام المؤمنين السيدة عائشة واتهامها بما يخل بالشرف والكرامة لأزواج النبي امهات المؤمنين رضوان الله تعالى عليهن.

لذا نرجو من سماحتكم التكرم ببيان الموقف الشرعي بوضوح لما سببته الاثارات المسيئة من اضطراب وسط المجتمع الاسلامي وخلق حالة من التوتر النفسي بين المسلمين من اتباع مدرسة أهل البيت عليهم السلام وسائر المسلمين من المذاهب الاسلامية ، علما ان هذه الاساءات استغلت وبصورة منهجية من بعض المغرضين ومثيري الفتن في بعض الفضائيات والانترنت لتشويش وارباك الساحة الاسلامية واثارة الفتنة بين المسلمين .

ختاما دمتم عزا وذخرا للاسلام والمسلمين .

التوقيع

جمع من علماء ومثقفي الاحساء
4 / شوال / 1431هـــــ

I would like to pose a question to khamenie and his followers... What proof has he (khamenei) used for his fatwas that ban Azadari, Tabarra and his slanderous claims attacking the infallibility of our Aima (as)? Is it possible to get any further from the true Shia belief?

36:77] Doth not man see that it is We Who created him from sperm? yet behold! he (stands forth) as an open adversary!

May Maula (as) give us the ability to distinguish between the real and the fake scholars...

by Azadar E Mazloom Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:01 am

Incidentally, here is a hadith in AL IHTIJAJ AL TABARSI – VOL 2 by our Imam (as) in reference to scholars pretending to be lovers of the Ahlul Bayt (as).

Tafsir of Imam Hassan Al Askari (asws) of Surah Al-Baqarah verses 77 & 78

And there are among them illiterates who know not the Book but only lies, and they do but conjecture. Woe, then, to those who write the book with their hands and then say: This is from Allah, so that they may take for it a small price; therefore woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they earn. (2:77-78)

The Holy Imam Hassan Al Askari (a.s.) has narrated that: 'Allah (s.w.t.) said to the Holy Prophet (s.a.w.) that: 'O Muhammad (s.a.w.)! From among the Jews there are some illiterates who do not know how to read or write just like an 'Ummi', which is actually associated with 'Umm', that is as if one has just been born and he does not know to read or write. They are those who neither know the Divine Book nor do they know the book that falsifies it and cannot differentiate between the two unless someone reads it for them and says that this is from Allah (s.w.t.). From whatever is written therein, if someone were to relate something opposite to it then they would never be able to identify it. These people base their talk on conjecture, and are falsifying their Master the Holy Prophet (s.a.w.) and the leader of his (s.a.w.) pure progeny Ali Ibn Abi Talib (a.s.)'s Imamat.

Whoever does this falsification, these it is that they emulate (Do Taqleed of), although it is forbidden for them to do so’. A person came to the Holy Imam Ja'far Al Sadiq (a.s.) and asked, 'O son of the Prophet! What is the reason behind Allah (s.w.t.)'s condemnation of the Jews that they cannot recognise the Proof of Allah (s.w.t.) without listening to their Priests when they do not have any recourse other than this. Then how come they have been condemned for having emulated them and listening to them despite the fact that their people are like our people, that they listen to their Priests when it is not allowable for them to do so whilst we have been permitted to listen to our priests?’ The Holy Imam (a.s.) replied: 'In between our people and our priests, and their people and their priests, there is a difference as well as a similarity. For what is similar between the two, Allah (s.w.t.) has also condemned the Muslims for emulating their priests just like their people having been condemned. From what is the difference between the two our people have not been condemned for emulating their priests.' The person asked, 'Can you please explain the reason for this?'

The Holy Imam (a.s.) replied: 'The Jews were aware that their priests normally used to lie to them and eat that which is unlawful, and take bribes, and with someone's recommendation or as a favour to someone, amend the laws of Allah (s.w.t.) and they knew that their Priests were extremely prejudicial due to which they stray away from their religion. When they deal with someone with their prejudice, they deny him his rights, whilst they give his wealth to the one that they have decided to favour, and thus they are unjust on the rightful person. They surely know that these priests are unlawful in their deeds, despite that their hearts knew that whoever does so is a mischief maker, and that they do not accept the Prophets as intermediaries between Allah (s.w.t.) and his creatures, they still emulate them. This is the reason for their condemnation by Allah (s.w.t.). They emulated those that they knew, and knew about them that to take news from them and verify their speech about that person whom they had not seen, to act upon the words of their Priests is not correct, and it was obligatory upon them to ponder over the Holy prophet (s.a.w.) because his (s.a.w.) proofs were not hidden and were clear and well known and they were all aware of these.

The order is the same for this Ummah as well, when they know that their Priests are involved in mischief and injustices and are very prejudicial and are openly inimical for the sake of the wealth of this world and prohibited deeds, and destroy the one whom they are prejudicial against although he could have been corrected by good advice. The one that they are close to, they become lenient with him and deal with him favourably although he may be deserving of disgrace and punishment. So, those of our people who emulate these priests are like those Jews who have been condemned due to their emulation of their mischievous and unjust priests.But, Whoever of the jurists safeguards himself, is protective of his religion, opposes his temptations, is obedient to his Master’s commands, then the common people must emulate him, and this is only for some of the Shiite Jurists and not all of them.

These characteristics are to be found in only some of the priests of the Shiites and not in all of them, because that priest who is like the mischief making jurist of the Muslims, who indulges in bad deeds, do not accept any of our orders from them and do not honour and respect them in any way. In order to gain this respect from the people, they have added a lot of their words to ours. When our words reach the mischief makers, they change them a lot due to their ignorance and they place them wrongly due to their lack of intellect and deliberately forge lies against us so that they can accumulate the wealth of this world, and this will be an entrance to Hell for them.

There is a group of Nasibis who, although are not capable of denying our authority, nevertheless learn our correct knowledge and take it to our Shiites. They talk about our deficiencies to our enemies and then they add certain false talks, which we are completely free from and strongly annoyed with. Some of our obedient Shiites accept these talks as being knowledge emanating from us, the Holy Ahl Ul Bayt (a.s.). These are people who have gone astray and are leading others astray. These types of people (Nasibis) damage our weak minded Shiites more than the damage done by the army of Yazeed on the Holy Imam Husayn (a.s.) and his (a.s.) companions, because they take their lives and their wealth. This is more damaging, in our eyes, than the damage done by the army of Yazeed.

These bad Nasibi scholars, who portray themselves as the friends of our friends and the enemies of our enemies, create doubts in the beliefs of our Shiites, lead them astray and stop them from walking on the right and pure way. But, from those strayed people, about whom Allah (s.w.t.) knows their intentions of safeguarding their religion, and respect and honour the Trustee of Allah (s.w.t.), He (s.w.t.) does not let them stay with these mischievous unbelievers, and appoints an honourable believer who shows him the right way, and then Grants him the understanding to accept his advice, and in this way for this person there is betterment in this world and in the hereafter while there are curses in this world for those that led him astray, and collects the punishment for them in the hereafter.'

After this the Holy Imam Ja'far Al Sadiq (a.s.) said: 'The Holy prophet (s.a.w.) said, 'The mischievous and evil scholar of my Ummah is the one who lead people astray away from us cut them off from our ways and call them by using our names and our titles for those that oppose us and they send salutations and greetings on them although they are deserving of curses and punishment, and they send curses on us, although we are honourable and lofty in our positions with Allah (s.w.t.) and are in receipt of salutations and greeting from Allah (s.w.t.) and His angels, and we are unconcerned with the salutations and greetings for them.

Part of the article by Bashir Alidina.

Maula (as) waris.

by Silat_warrior110 Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:51 am

I think before we come to any conclusion to this fatwa, it is best to understand as to why it was passed in the first place. I am not a big fan of Khameni and his policys however this fatwa was given in response to a channel called " Fadak Tv" who where accusing Aisha (la) of constantly been in janabah and accusing her of committing zinah. Now this channel was been broadcasted around 47 countries world wide where Shia communitys are a complete minority in most of them. Could you imgaine the consqequences of such a stunt? In order to prevent blood shead in certain parts of the world, Khameni had to pass this fatwa to prevent any bloodshed in the streets. Also I think I have already posted this Very Happy

by Azadar E Mazloom Sun Oct 24, 2010 2:32 pm

Brother Silat, I can understand his (khameneis) reason for issuing such a fatwa but what I am contesting is his RIGHT to issue such a fatwa.

Has he based this ruling on holy scriptures (as i asked above), if so, where is his proof? If not, then who gave him the right to decree something haram that Allah (swt) and the Ma'sumin (as) have condoned and decreed halal?

by Silat_warrior110 Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:17 am

Allah (SWT) says in the Noble Qur'an: "The believers are but a single brotherhood. Make peace and reconciliation between your two (contending) brothers and fear Allah so that you may receive mercy." (49-10)

The utmost important duty for every Muslim is to preserve and protect the Muslim unity and not to cause any division in the Muslim rank. The Islamic nation is going through difficult circumstances, and facing major crises and enormous challenges affecting its present and threatening its future. Everyone is aware of this situation and needs to close ranks and reject those who fan the flames of sectarianism and we must avoid stirring sectarian differences. Hence why this fatwa was passed by the Iranian leader.

Those differences that have existed for centuries, and no completely satisfactory resolution pleasing to all parties seems to exist, and hence should not be pursued for the sake of creating controversy and strife, but only within the framework of scientific research in a sober and in particular in a manner that does not affect the fundamentals of Islam.

Everyone believes in One God, and the message of Prophet Mustafa (saw) and final messenger to mankind, and in the concept of Ma'ad (Ressurection/Judgement), and the fact that the Quran - which is guarded and protected by Allah from distortion - along with the Honourable Prophetic Sunnah (Tradition) which is the source for the Shari'a (Islamic Legal) rulings and the affection for the Holy Ahl al-Bayt (as), peace be upon them, and so on; these basics are shared by the Muslims in general, among which are the pillars of Islam: Prayer, Fasting, Hajj and so on. These common concepts form the basic core for Islamic Unity. We must focus on them to establish closer bonds of love and affection between the people of this Ummah, and indeed do no less than work on peaceful co-existence amongst each other, and move away from bickering and communal and sectarian rhetoric under whatever guise or title.

by Azadar E Mazloom Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:23 pm

Silat_warrior110 wrote:Allah (SWT) says in the Noble Qur'an: "The believers are but a single brotherhood. Make peace and reconciliation between your two (contending) brothers and fear Allah so that you may receive mercy." (49-10)

The utmost important duty for every Muslim is to preserve and protect the Muslim unity and not to cause any division in the Muslim rank. The Islamic nation is going through difficult circumstances, and facing major crises and enormous challenges affecting its present and threatening its future.

Mashallah, thanks for the quote brother Silat but you have failed to show me where in the Quran it asks us to compromise our beliefs for this idea you are proposing. It is interesting that you mentioned 'peace & reconciliation' as it only seems to be the wahabis that want to fight and kill us. Or do you have a speech from Tahir ul Qadri where he is telling people to kill the Shia?

If you believe the animosity against the Shia is simply due to tabarra, you are not only mistaken but also naive! The animosity is due to the fact that we believe in the Wilayat of Amir ul Momineen Maula Ali (as), anything else is simply a smoke screen to hide this fundamental hate of theirs.

Everyone believes in One God, and the message of Prophet Mustafa (saw) and final messenger to mankind, and in the concept of Ma'ad (Ressurection/Judgement), and the fact that the Quran - which is guarded and protected by Allah from distortion - along with the Honourable Prophetic Sunnah (Tradition) which is the source for the Shari'a (Islamic Legal) rulings and the affection for the Holy Ahl al-Bayt (as), peace be upon them, and so on;

these basics are shared by the Muslims in general, among which are the pillars of Islam: Prayer, Fasting, Hajj and so on. These common concepts form the basic core for Islamic Unity.

We must focus on them to establish closer bonds of love and affection between the people of this Ummah, and indeed do no less than work on peaceful co-existence amongst each other, and move away from bickering and communal and sectarian rhetoric under whatever guise or title.

Brother Silat, once again I have to point out to you, most of the Muslim World DOES live in harmony, love and affection. The only people that don't are the wahabis. Do you really want to go against the fundamentals of your own beliefs (tabarra) for THEM? Also, applying the same argument, shouldn't we then focus our attention to humanity in general? Or atleast the Jews and the Christians. If we're to begin compromising our beliefs for others, why stop with JUST these 'Muslims'?

Let me ask you, do you believe we are doing wrong by cursing and condemning the killers of the Ma'sumin (as)? Also, I am still waiting for some kind of proof to back this preposterous fatwa by khamenei.

by Silat_warrior110 Fri Oct 29, 2010 3:25 pm

Salam sorry I have been a little busy, now you have requested proof based on this fatwa. A Submitter should be noticed by the way he/she presents him/herself to the world and other sects in Islam. The Quran, contains clear instructions to follow on conducting yourself the way God wants us to. By setting a good example to the world, it will give the correct message of Islam (Submission) to those around us.

How Should we Deal with Sunnies?

Not equal are the good response and the bad response. You shall resort to the nicest possible response. Thus, the one who used to be your enemy, may become your best friend. [41:34]

The Quran states clearly that one should present a good conduct and should avoid creating Fitnah, and Allah (swt) curses fitnah makers. Rather then using measures that causes more hate and blood shead, we should come to common terms with such people. As the Quran states , "the one who used to be your enemy, may become your best friend"

The Ahlulbayt (as) did not once curse their (as) enemys openly as it is done at present. This is not the akhlaq of the Ahlulbayt (as), the Ahlulbayt (as) even lived under the leadership of such tyrants (la) where they (as) them self did not fight againgst them, so then who are you ?

As for your Question on the Jews and Christians the Quran I have explained this before in the above post, please go back and take a read...

“And the Jews and Christians will never be pleased with you till you follow their religion…” [2: 120]

(Say (O Muhammad to them): "Believe in it (the Qur'an) or do not believe (in it). Verily, those who were given knowledge before it, when it is recited to them, fall down on their faces in humble prostration. And they say: "Glory be to our Lord! Truly, the promise of our Lord must be fulfilled.'') (17:107-108).

Now as I stated before we can come to many common terms with Sunnies Unlike the other none muslim sects. Unity amongst the Muslims by saying: “Whoever testifies to the oneness of Allah; whoever faces our direction of prayer; whoever prays like us; whoever eats the meat that was slaughtered by Muslims is a Muslim.”

Now can show me from the Quran that cursing openly is allowed?

Now can you show me where the Ahlulbayt (as) cursed them openely?

Why did Imam Ali (as) not fight againgst 1,2 3?

please answer in light of Quran and Hadith as I have done so...

by Azadar E Mazloom Fri Oct 29, 2010 3:57 pm

Wa Alaiykum Asalam.

Silat_warrior110 wrote:[color=black]Salam sorry I have been a little busy, now you have requested proof based on this fatwa. A Submitter should be noticed by the way he/she presents him/herself to the world and other sects in Islam. The Quran, contains clear instructions to follow on conducting yourself the way God wants us to. By setting a good example to the world, it will give the correct message of Islam (Submission) to those around us.

How Should we Deal with Sunnies?

Not equal are the good response and the bad response. You shall resort to the nicest possible response. Thus, the one who used to be your enemy, may become your best friend. [41:34]
The Quran states clearly that one should present a good conduct and should avoid creating Fitnah, and Allah (swt) curses fitnah makers. Rather then using measures that causes more hate and blood shead, we should come to common terms with such people. As the Quran states , "the one who used to be your enemy, may become your best friend"
The Ahlulbayt (as) did not once curse their (as) enemys openly as it is done at present. This is not the akhlaq of the Ahlulbayt (as), the Ahlulbayt (as) even lived under the leadership of such tyrants (la) where they (as) them self did not fight againgst them, so then who are you ?

Thanks for your reply brother Silat, coming straight to the point, can you tell me once where I have stated to openly curse the 3 (la) infront of sunni's? The fatwa of the marja did not distinguish 'infront' or 'away' from sunni's rather it was a blanket ban.

So seeing as the verse you quoted from the noble Qur'an has NOTHING to do with the issue at hand, once again, are you able to provide me with proof stating tabarra is haram? That is what we're arguing right?

Also, I would not advise you to quote verses from the Quran unless/until you have good understanding of them.

Now moving on to your next point:

The Ahlulbayt (as) did not once curse their (as) enemys openly as it is done at present. This is not the akhlaq of the Ahlulbayt (as), the Ahlulbayt (as) even lived under the leadership of such tyrants (la) where they (as) them self did not fight againgst them, so then who are you

Once again, you have based your whole argument on the misconception that this discussion is about cursing openly or cursing that causes fitnah. Now, are you able to argue the actual argument and not the argument you want it to be?

Moving onto your next point:

As for your Question on the Jews and Christians the Quran I have explained this before in the above post, please go back and take a read... “And the Jews and Christians will never be pleased with you till you follow their religion…” [2: 120]

Brother Silat, literalism is a disease for the wahabis and not for ourselves... The verse above spoke of the Christians and Jews as they were the majority and (arguably) the enemy AT THAT TIME. Do you really believe that this verse applied ONLY to the Jews and Christians? If so, does that mean in todays World we are able to follow the desires of all other religions as they are not mentioned in this verse? What a silly argument!

I find it ironic that you mentioned this verse as this verse is telling us NOT to follow other peoples desires when it comes to your beliefs. Would you mind telling me what was khameneis reason for issuing such a fatwa? Oh yes... To appease other faiths!

Now as I stated before we can come to many common terms with Sunnies Unlike the other none muslim sects. Unity amongst the Muslims by saying: “Whoever testifies to the oneness of Allah; whoever faces our direction of prayer; whoever prays like us; whoever eats the meat that was slaughtered by Muslims is a Muslim.”

Brother Silat, without Wilayat E Ali (as), what direction once faces whilst praying, what kind of meat one eat etc etc has nothing to do with anything. Even the Jews believe in the 'oneness' of God.

Even though I had already addressed this issue above, let me ask you again.

The critieria you mentioned above, includes and describes the taliban perfectly. The taliban (I'm sure you know) not only hate the Ahlul Bayt (As), love the enemies of the Ahlul Bayt (as) but also kill anyone who loves/believes in the Ahlul Bayt (as). Are you really ready and willing to compromise your faith for these people? Think about this before you answer...

1) Now can show me from the Quran that cursing openly is allowed?

2) Now can you show me where the Ahlulbayt (as) cursed them openely?

3) Why did Imam Ali (as) not fight againgst 1,2 3?

please answer in light of Quran and Hadith as I have done so..

1) Already answered above

2 & 3

Absolutely not... Khamenei has issued a fatwa that tabarra is haram whereas our Holy Imam Jaffar Al Sadiq (a.s.) said:

‘Everything is permissible unless there is a prohibition order for it.’
WASAAIL US SHIA – VOL 6 CH 19 H 7997

So before you begin to ask me questions, why don't you answer my question and show me proof for tabarra being haram?

.

by Silat_warrior110 Sun Oct 31, 2010 12:54 pm

This fatwa was said under Taqqiyh, in fear of the outcome for the Shias communitys who are in small minortys across the world. So do you agree that Tabarrah should not be done openly?

by Azadar E Mazloom Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:50 pm

Silat_warrior110 wrote:This fatwa was said under Taqqiyh, in fear of the outcome for the Shias communitys who are in small minortys across the world.

Firsty, do you have any proof from the Quran or Hadith that a none Masum Scholar is able to decree halal into haram (due to taqqiyah) for anyone other then himself?

Secondly, do you have any proof that khameneis fatwa banning tabarra was done in taqqiyah? Or is this simply something you thought up all on your own in your continued defence of khameneii and his decision to decree something haram that wasn't forbidden by Allah (Swt) in the Quran or by any teachings of the Masumin (as)?

So do you agree that Tabarrah should not be done openly?

Brother Silat, I must inform you again, let us stick to the topic at hand. The issue here isn't about what I believe OR whether tabarra should be done openly or behind closed doors. khamenei gave a blanket ban and THAT is the only issue here so please, let us not stray from the issue at hand and if you could please answer my previous question.

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